095: Giving yourself permission to evolve & other success secrets with Amy Porterfield

Kate Kordsmeier 0:00

Welcome, welcome. We're back with the Success with Soul podcast. I'm your host, Kate Kordsmeier. And today we are back with a third time appearance from the one and the only Amy Porterfield. So you guys know we've had her on the podcast in the past, we had her on doing an episode two years ago about how to create an online course and actually build the confidence to sell it. In that episode, we talked with Amy all about how she got into digital course creation in the first place, especially when it was basically all men, what the 10% edge is, and how it can help you beat impostor syndrome pricing secrets for selling, and why it's still a great time for digital courses and elearning. We have you three action steps you can take right now to get started in that episode. And then we had her on again, all about marketing and selling online courses like a pro, we talked evergreen versus live launching, we went into what you need covered before you launch how to troubleshoot a failed launch the systems and strategies AMI swears by how to leverage paid ads, the importance of presence and getting creative with live and evergreen content, and how to shift your online courses and deliver them as you scale so you don't burn out. So when I was having me back on for the third time this year, and of course, this is in preparation for the Digital Course Academy launch coming up on September 7 2022. I was thinking about what could we talk about that we haven't already covered? Because if you miss those two episodes I already mentioned, please go back and listen, they are super juicy. But what can we talk about that was new and different. And something that started coming to me as I was thinking about questions I wanted to ask Amy is about giving ourselves this permission to evolve, what's working and 2022 is not the same thing that was working in 2015, or even 2021. And what Amy is selling now and how she's delivering it is not the same as when she originally started. And I think that the reason it's so important to talk about this evolution and this permission to change your mind and to change direction and change course and grow and improve and evolve, is because I think that when we don't give ourselves that permission, we don't take action because it feels too overwhelming, and too permanent, to make a decision that we feel like has to be forever. And so I hope that this episode will show you that nobody does anything the same way forever. And that in fact, this adaptability, this flexibility, this evolution is exactly the thing that makes Amy as successful as she has been. And it starts with not taking yourself too seriously with letting go of perfectionism. And with giving yourself permission that what you decide today does not have to be what you do forever. And I think when we let go of that permanence, we can actually move forward and do the thing. And if you take nothing else away from this episode, it's this. Just do it. Just do it. It's you're building it up to be way bigger deal in your head than it actually is. And when you actually just do it, you'll realize that you can change, you can evolve. You can see what works and what didn't what feels good and what doesn't, what your customers like and what they don't. It's all a living, breathing process. And I can't wait to dive in so you can hear all about Amy's experience of evolving her own business and how DCA has evolved since she first launched it, what she includes in it now that she didn't use to what she recommends other course creators add to their own programs and how they deliver them differently in 2022. So it's another super juicy episode and I can't wait to dive in. Here we go.

Intro 4:03

You're listening to the Success with Soul podcast with Kate Kordsmeier ex-journalists turned CEO of a multi six figure blog and online business. But it wasn't that long ago that Kate was a struggling entrepreneur who lacked confidence, clarity and let's be honest money. But all those failures, experiments and lessons learned helped Kay create a thriving business that impacts 1000s and brings freedom, flexibility and fulfillment to her life. If you're ready to do the same and make something happen with holistic, soulful, step by step strategies from Kate and other experts, you're in the right place. Here's your host writer, educator, Mom recovering perfectionist, bookworm and sushi connoisseur Kate Kordsmeier

Kate Kordsmeier 4:56

Welcome back, Amy. You are third time repeat est. I love it.

Amy Porterfield 5:01

Oh my goodness, I feel so special. Thanks for having me.

Kate Kordsmeier 5:04

Yeah, I was just saying we haven't done an interview in a while. So you're my first one back. So bear with me if I'm a little rusty and like managing conversation flow and questions, but I'm excited to chat.

Amy Porterfield 5:15

It's gonna be great.

Kate Kordsmeier 5:16

Yeah. So we're heading into the DCA launch. Super exciting. Of course, I'm always a huge fan of DCA, having taken it myself totally turned my business around and changed everything for me. I've told that story many times. I'm curious how you're feeling going into. I don't even know if you know off the top of your head. Like what number launch? Is this for DCI?

Amy Porterfield 5:38

Oh, gosh, I will. I was thinking we've had the program for three years. But we've launched it a few times more than that. So I'm gonna guess maybe five or six. Yeah. And yeah, it's a big deal. So it's so funny. You bring that up, because I was thinking and talking to some students the other day around this idea of live launching and evergreen launching and, and which one should they do. And I'm a big fan of having a live launch in your business, I feel like creates so many benefits for you and your students. But I'm also a really big fan of evergreen. I love both models. So as I get ready to open up the doors for Digital Course Academy, it is a different kind of energy. It is a different kind of focus. Like I'm like, okay, game on. I just came off of a five week sabbatical, so I cannot complain. But it is like, I gotta be present ready for it? Here we go.

Kate Kordsmeier 6:28

Yeah, yeah, totally. I know. And I think, you know, we were just saying before we hit record, like there's a lot of internal pressure that we put on ourselves for live launches. Doesn't have to be that way. That's totally like a choice that we're making ourselves. But that's interesting to hear. It's I mean, I think it's always just nice to hear when even somebody as successful as you is like, I still deal with the same stuff like yeah, no matter what stage you're at in your business, or how much money you've made, or how many clients you have, it's still like we're all dealing with the same like mind trash.

Amy Porterfield 7:02

Absolutely. I can't even believe how I didn't know when I first started my business how important it is to deal with the mind stuff at all times. Like if you would have told me 13 years ago, you will still feel like an impostor at times, you will still feel like you're not cut out to do this. Even after so much success in so many years. I'd be like, No way. Oh, it's very Yeah.

Kate Kordsmeier 7:23

Well, even I was just listening to your crime junkies episode on your podcast before this. And at the end of it, you say like, Man, I gotta admit, like, I was really nervous going into that episode, because she has 35 million downloads a month. That's like unfathomable. But yeah. And I was thinking, Oh, well, I'm kind of nervous going into this interview. But it makes me less nervous knowing that like you also get nervous because you're also a human.

Amy Porterfield 7:51

So true. We have to remind, especially the women, we got to stick together and remind each other, like what we're feeling what we're thinking, the good, bad and ugly throughout this entire entrepreneurial journey to remind each other. We are so not alone.

Kate Kordsmeier 8:04

Yes. So not alone. Well, okay, so you're coming into like, Well, you said you launched DCAA, three years ago. But I know before that you kind of had two courses that you made into 1am. I remembering that right? Yeah, exactly. Okay, so just can you tell us a little bit about like, all of the iterations of your course model, you know, and like how DCA has evolved since you first launched it?

Amy Porterfield 8:30

Yes. And I love this question. I don't typically get asked this. And what I love about it is because I think it can remind all of us that what we're doing now doesn't need to be set in stone forever. And there's so many iterations that and opportunities ahead of us, no matter if you're just starting out, or you've been at it for a while. So with Digital Course Academy, what had happened is I had a really successful course called webinars that convert, and that was one of my most most successful courses I've ever done. And I launched out to the world, people went through it, they learned how to do these amazing webinars, and then they'd say, okay, me, I'm ready. But I have nothing to sell on a webinar. What do I do now? Like, oh, okay, so then I created courses that convert to give some people something to actually sell. And so really, if if in a perfect world courses, that convert would have came first and then webinars that convert, but it didn't happen that way. So then I have courses that convert and webinars that convert, I'm selling them individually, and someone will create a course and they're like, how do I market it? Like you have to buy my other product, or I've done a webinar, but what do I sell, you have to buy my other product. I didn't love that feeling. And I knew both of them were essentially incomplete. But I didn't know this in the beginning. And both of them did very well for the record. So you never know even though you don't have it all figured out. You could still be successful. And then one day one of my employees, she was really young and she just like kind of new to the team and flippantly said you should combine those two courses. And I remember being at the It's just terrible of me being so irritated, like, that's a big undertaking or just throw out that idea. Like, it's no big deal. She said it so flippantly. I was like, You should try it. I was like, oh gosh, maybe I should check myself. So after apologizing to her for being weird and snapping like that, I slept on it for a few days. And I'm like, she's absolutely right, I need to combine these two to make it a better experience and get bigger results for my students. So took both courses, broke them fully down reengineer, the entire outline of how this could look, I went back into the studio, and I recorded the entire thing brand new over starting from scratch. And it became Digital Course Academy of what it is today. And best decision I ever made. But dang, it was hard to get to that decision, because it included so much like it felt like such a big undertaking. But I was hesitant to do it. So glad I did. But now the Digital Course Academy that will be launching in early September, it has gone through multiple iterations. And when I say iterations, when you have a digital course, what you're really always looking for is how do I make this easier for my students? How do I get them through the course quicker, with less effort less overwhelmed. So over the years, we've just dialed that in, dial that in, I feel like we've got the best product I've ever created. I recently re recorded the whole thing. And I looked at my team, and I'm like, holy cow, that is a really good course. And it's just like, oh, surprise me, because I had to be reminded we put so much love and support into this thing. Yeah, it has definitely been on a journey.

Kate Kordsmeier 11:34

Yeah. Well, I asked that question. Because I just feel like people often and myself included, we can take ourselves very seriously, we feel like what we decide today has to be what we do forever. So it has to be the perfect Yes, most right decision. And it's so refreshing to hear that it's like, no, you tried one thing, it didn't even come in the right order, you still were able to have success, you were still able to evolve and make changes and keep your customers happy. Like there's permission to evolve,

Amy Porterfield 12:05

permission to evolve. And, and it's such a beautiful thing to talk about. Because I want I don't think we talked about it enough. And too, when you're making decisions in your business, whether you're just started out or you're getting the messy millennial or wherever you are, to make a big decision and think you have to stick with it forever is very scary, which is probably why a lot of people don't take action. By do this one big thing. Now I'm stuck with it, you're absolutely not. When I was first starting out my very first digital course when I didn't have an email list, I didn't know what the heck I was doing was how to use social media to launch a book. Now, I've never launched a book in my life. So I should never have been teaching. But I thought, oh gosh, this will allow me to like put me on the map, and people will know what to come to me for. So I created this course and I made $267. So yeah, I was like holy cow, I thought you make $100,000 Because everyone else seemed to be making tons of money. So I was super depressed. But also, I should have not been teaching that. And so what I tell my students now is you just need that 10% edge, you need to have gotten results for yourself, or for somebody else, like a customer or client. And you're willing to show that roadmap of how you got the results in your course. So the 10 percentage means you're 10% ahead of those you serve, I created a course where I wasn't even 10% ahead, I just like studied it, but I didn't have results in it. And that's where I had made the mistake. But from there, I learned Oh, I made a mistake here. Let's go back to the drawing board. The next course I created, I made a few $1,000 with it. And it was how to use social media in general to build a business. And so that's where I was definitely more well versed in that. And then from there, I realized what people really want because when you create something, your audience will tell you what to do next. They wanted Facebook marketing. So my first really successful course was all about how to do Facebook marketing. And then from there how to do Facebook ads. And then from there, that's where webinars that convert and courses that convert came to be, I wouldn't have a multimillion dollar business I have today, if I didn't allow myself to pivot make some changes evolve. It's not like I was like chasing this shiny object and chasing that shiny object and getting way off course. I was just evolving. And there is nothing wrong with that.

Kate Kordsmeier 14:21

Yeah, yeah, such a good lesson. And just, I think that 10% edge. I know we've talked about that before. And something that kind of reminds me of what you said too, is the point of but you actually have to have gotten those results for yourself or somebody else. We talk about this a lot in my program too, which is like being a product of your product. And so that like if you don't believe that you can get the results. So like we have in this example of we had a client who was wanting to create a course on helping women leave their nine to five and start their own business, but she herself hadn't left her nine to five yet. And so I you know she hadn't even gotten to the launch phase yet, but I just can't kept encouraging her to like, maybe get that result for yourself first because it's going to be so hard to sell that when your energy and your belief is like, well, I don't even know if I can do this.

Amy Porterfield 15:10

Yes, that is so true. I had the exact same experience a woman came up to me at a live event. She was a young woman, I loved her so much her she had great energy. And she said, I want to teach people how to funny enough leave their job by selling real estate, like flipping houses on the side, and taking those flip houses taking that revenue and leave your job. And I'm like, okay, great. So you've done that. She's like, No, I'm trying to, and right away, I had to give her the tough love. Yeah. Okay, wait till you do it. And then you can put it all over the web, like, look what I've done. And here's my roadmap, right? But when people hear that, they might be like, Oh, okay, so I'm not ready for a course I gotta do all this stuff. No, no, you already have a course in you, all of us have multiple courses in us, I have no doubt. And you have to look at what you've done in your life, both in your professional and personal life, there are results you have already gotten that can be a digital course. So you don't have to wait until you get somewhere you've already gotten there, my friend, it's just reminding yourself that just because you've done it, and it might have felt easy or in your past doesn't mean other people don't want to know how you've done it. It's not easy to them, it doesn't come second nature to them. And also, you definitely don't need years of experience or more certifications. In order to be worthy of creating a course I'm gonna give you an example, let's pretend that your best friend was a little out of shape for a long time, like going up the stairs, she was out of breath. But she kind of got sick of feeling that way. So she decided to train for a marathon. And in six months, that woman went from being tired of going up the stairs to actually running a full blown marathon and doing an amazing job. And afterwards, you looked at her and you're like, holy cow, I want to do that. How did you do that? Tell me all the things. And you want to know her food plan her habits, the tennis shoes, she got her plan, like how she figured out how to go from zero to a marathon. And she starts to tell you all these things. There's not one point that you would have said Okay, wait, before you tell me all the things. Are you certified in tennis shoes and how to tennis shoes? Or did you go to a nutrition class in order to know what to eat? No, she got the results that you want. She is someone you love and relate to and connect to. You want to learn from someone like that. That's how your students are going to feel as well. So I want you all to remember

Kate Kordsmeier 17:30

that. And like she didn't have to win the marathon. She didn't have to run 20 marathons. It's like she's like you always say like, a few steps ahead of somebody who's like, well, I've never run a marathon and that sounds totally daunting. Tell me I'll all the family all

Amy Porterfield 17:45

the things. Yep. Someone that might be unlikely to have gotten those results that's even sexier to most people. Yeah, you could do it. Maybe I can do

Kate Kordsmeier 17:53

totally totally so much more relatable than going like all the way to Yeah, the person who's like winning, you know, a Olympic marathons you're like, right, I'm probably not on the same level as needing to learn how they're exactly what their routine is. So yeah. Okay, so something else you mentioned that I want to come back to is like your students telling you what they wanted, and figuring out like your next thing from listening to that. And making every iteration was like making it easier for your students to get results. So one of the questions that I have on my list here is like, how do you build accountability into like, a self study course? And how much personal responsibility? Do you as the course creator take in like, you can't make somebody do the work? This has been like a hot topic of conversation in my world lately. So I'm very curious, your thoughts on it?

Amy Porterfield 18:45

This is such a great question, I'm gonna go for the last one first, and then go back to the accountability. So you are right, you cannot make somebody get the results that you're promising. And so when you're a course creator, the thing that should allow you to take a deep breath and just relax around this topic is that there's only so much you can do, but you have a big responsibility. So number one, you've already gotten the results in one way or another. So you feel like you can lay out the roadmap check that's on you. Number two, you're responsible for creating a course that literally does walk them through a roadmap so that they really understand each step that is necessary for them to get to the finish line. And the third thing and something I teach all my students and it's a very big part of Digital Course Academy is how to get people to the finish line. What do they need to virtually handhold their experience so you can handhold hold their hand through the experience to get them to the finish line? Do they need certain pep talks at certain times during the course? Do they need extra resources like PDFs and guides and cheat sheets to go along? Do they need a private member podcast where you take your videos, strip them down to audio and now if they're on the go, they can listen to the audio so that they can get it done? There's so much as a course creator you can do to make the experience as easy and see unless it is possible to help them get to that finish line. And I teach all of that in DCA, because I think it's important to help your students get to the finish line. But there's also another person involved the student, they have to show up, they have to book time on their calendar, they have to do the work. And that is not your responsibility at that point. So you can feel great as of course, grader, I delivered on my promise. And now I'm going to encourage them to keep going, but they're going to have to take agency over that. So there are always two people in this equation. And when I started to teach my students that I noticed they kind of took a deep breath, and they're like, Okay, I can do my part for sure. I have hundreds and hundreds of success stories. So I know that doing your part as a course creator will absolutely encourage your students to get to the finish line. So you're a big part of that for sure. Yeah. The other thing that you mentioned was the accountability, especially in a self study course. So when I think self study course, I think you're not going live every single day or every single week, even let's pretend you're not live at all in your course, you've pre recorded your videos, you're going to deliver them to every week or all at once, whatever you want to do. But what if they have questions? What if they get stuck along the way, there's a few things I teach my students to do. Number one is, I love a good FAQ vault. And this is something that you can build up over time. But there's always a place in my courses where you can go to a page, and you can keyword search questions you have. And every question in my written response will come up based on that search, you've done. I have hundreds of questions I've answered because I've done the course for over three years. So as I answer questions, now I put them in the vault. So over time, you're gonna have a really robust vault that will totally or vault that will totally support your students. So that's a big thing that you can do to keep them accountable. And now

Kate Kordsmeier 21:52

he's searching for that. Yes, yeah. So I

Amy Porterfield 21:55

love searching for this. It's such a great tool. So that search, this is okay, so let's talk about that for a second. For those who don't know, I do a lot of video q&a and Digital Course Academy, but a lot of people can't make those live. So let's say you searched how to build an email list. All the videos where I mentioned, one of those keywords will pop up instantly. And you can go to the place in my q&a, like 32 minutes in where I'm talking about list building. I think it's like the coolest tool ever. It is so cool. Yeah. So how are you searching? And then I also write out my responses so they can get written or video responses from me based on questions I've answered hundreds of times. Yeah. And then the other thing is that we always make sure that we allow people to get accountability partners. So we put up a one sheet, we say, here's how to get an accountability partner, if you want to apply for one, add your name to the spreadsheet. So we set up the infrastructure. And then my students can then take control and say if they want to accountability partner, I'll follow these guidelines and find one because I think accountability is made accountability partners make a big difference. Yeah, that's

Kate Kordsmeier 23:01

such a good idea. But again, even that is something that it's like, you can provide them the resource for accountability partners, but they have to be the ones to actually go in and do it. You know, pick one.

Amy Porterfield 23:15

Absolutely. So some people don't want an accountability partner and the it's just not for them. Great. You've given them an opportunity, and they can decide what's right for them.

Kate Kordsmeier 23:24

Yeah. So along those lines, I'm curious, like, what live components you recommend, including in your course these days? Like, I think there's been a conversation too, that's kind of been happening, that maybe people got a little two self study with their courses. And then they started feeling like, okay, my clients either aren't getting results or, you know, aren't super satisfied. Yeah, be like, now people are creating kind of more hybrid models, where there's some kind of Yeah, live q&a, or a Facebook group, or like we do critiques in our programs. So they actually like submit their work. And we give them like a loom video back to show them like, this is what we'd recommend. What do you like to include, or, you know, teach to, to build in some of that kind of live

Amy Porterfield 24:06

support? Yes, I love that. So I have an evergreen program that runs every single day all about this building. And then Digital Course Academy is my live launch once a year. And in both, I offer a live aspect. And so let me break that down for you. So for my evergreen program, that it's an automated webinar selling into my course people can buy it anytime a day. When they get in there. One of the promises I make as a bonus is that once a month, they get a live q&a Group live q&a with me on Zoom, and they get 12 of them. So they get it for a full year, which is very attractive to my audience, knowing I'll be on the journey with them. And so I don't guarantee that I answer everybody's questions, but I get through a lot of questions in an hour. Yeah. And so I show up on Zoom once a month for anybody who is currently in Digital Course Academy and they're in those 12 months of getting that q&a. And it has worked out beautifully. We've done it for over a year and Basically every month they get a new zoom link. And when it's 13 months, and they don't get it anymore, they just won't get the Zoom link email. And we're all good to go. So we have it all dialed in. Yep, smarter than. So that works out really good. And I love that I don't have a Facebook group for them. I don't have any other live aspects, they've got the q&a vault. And we've had nothing but great feedback about that. So that's worked out well. And then with Digital Course Academy, I used to go live every so this is a great conversation to have, because I haven't talked about this a lot. In the past, I went live Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, every day for like, 20 to 30 minutes, I usually always went over. My husband hated it. Sure, always on live video. And I did this for a few years. And the feedback I got, and I got to see the numbers. One the same people kept showing up. But there weren't as many people that would show up for those lives, a lot would catch the replay. But even more importantly than who was on live and who was watching the replay was the students and many students felt very pressured that they were missing all these lives. Yeah, so like, I can't show up for that many lives, no matter that I said 100 times just come when you need to come and all there, it didn't matter. They saw a live pop up in their Facebook feed or an email come through, they were missing yet another thing from my program, that did not feel good. So when I got enough issue around that, like I heard enough feedback, I'm like, no more, we're not doing that. So now all go live once or twice a week. And then we supplement we've got a guy whose we call them our resident tech guy, Dave. And he's now going to do a live tech training once a week for anyone get that gets hung up on the tech. So when you listen to your students over the years, they're going to tell you what they need more of. And it might mean that you get to work actually less, it's easier for me to do less lives. And I think it's a really good fit for what they need. So I do live q&a, I'm just not doing as many because it overwhelmed my students. But there's other ways that you can show up for them. Like at the end of Digital Course Academy, we do a two day live virtual event we used to do in person, maybe one day, we get to bring it back that allows that it was so fun. I really do miss being in person with everyone. Yeah, but there's so many different things that you can do. And I do agree with you that people are going more toward a hybrid model. Because people miss the interaction, we went through two years of not seeing each other ever. We need to we need to show up for each other. Yeah.

Kate Kordsmeier 27:27

And so that kind of brings me to another question. This is something that one of my questions was like, What mistakes did you make when you first launched the course and thinking about those kinds of things? What would you do differently? For me, one of them is offering lifetime access? I'm curious if that's still something that you offer? And kind of why or why not? Okay, so

Amy Porterfield 27:47

that's such a great question. I do offer lifetime access for all my courses. But with a caveat. So you're so many great topics, you could tell you a good course creator. So we do lifetime access. But one thing I had to get really clear with my students is that when what that means is they get I want to make this clear, they get every time I update the program, the core program, they get that update. So that's a big perk for DCA. So I just re recorded the whole thing, any of my alumni will get that core program. But any new bonuses I add, that's for my new students, so they don't get all the bonuses forever and ever that I add. So we say the core program, if I update it, you get it. That's one thing we make clear and lifetime access. Yeah, another thing is, we make it clear, as long as I am delivering the program, you get access. And in the fine print, we say you will always have a full year into my program. But let's say I stop doing the program in a year, there will be no more new iterations, you don't get those, of course they don't exist. And if I want to shut down all my sites, you can download all the content, have it forever. But there might be a day that I don't want to do this anymore, I can't imagine but there could be. So I'm very clear. Now I don't explain all of that on a webinar. It's all in there like the fine print. But lifetime access means as long as I'm doing this program, you will always get access to it and at least a year. So to be fair, in case it ever ended, at least here. So anyway, that's what lifetime access looks like in our world. But I also know why some people don't do it. So I'd love to hear your reason why you don't offer it anymore.

Kate Kordsmeier 29:25

Yeah, well, I think you actually were very much on the same page with it. Because my next question for you what you answered was going to be how do you define lifetime access? Yeah, and one of the reasons this changed for me is because I used to have a program called the six figure blog Academy and I decided at the end of 20 like fall 2021 I was retiring the program. So I let everybody know and I said you have until December 2022 Oh wow. So it was like over a year. Yes. Get in download anything you need that program will go away, and we're not selling it anymore. And so it was interesting because we had most people were like, cool, totally understand. But of course, there's always like, you can't please everybody now, so that we had some people that were really upsetting. They're like, this is lifetime access. And so it made me pause and think, Well, what does lifetime access mean? I thought, Well, is it lifetime of the Creator? Like so as long as I'm alive? You still I have to catch

Amy Porterfield 30:29

up? Am I gonna be 80 years old, right on the porch? And I'm creating courses for them, like I freaked out in the beginning. Yes.

Kate Kordsmeier 30:35

Or even if you're not creating anything new, like, are you, you still have to keep paying for Kajabi, or whoever you're hosting. And like, it's not free to have a platform that people can log into. And you know, all that. So I was like, well, obviously, it's not lifetime of me, it can't be lifetime of the buyer. Right, everybody's different, some like it is lifetime of the program. And I think I probably could have been more clear about that in my fine print when I had originally said lifetime access. But now we just like all of our programs. And like I said, we do more of a hybrid model now where we have like a course curriculum, but then it's a lot of live components. And so it's more of like a coaching program, then gotcha straight course. But that is like, there's a container for it. And so even at the end of like, our container right now is 12 months. So at the end of 12 months, if you want to stay in the program, of course, to continue getting like the live coaching and support that we do. But then also even access to the materials like you have to pay again. And like you can renew, and we have some you know, specials for people who are renewal clients. That's, uh, yeah, but yeah, it's been it's been interesting. And I think it was a good lesson to me in first, just being super clear about whatever your terms are. So that it's like, there is no question about it. Now, of course, most people don't read the fine print anyway. So

Amy Porterfield 32:03

it's true. So it's always nice to have it there in case someone's like, hey, not fair. And you're like, Okay, I'll show you what this means. But I love that you brought up about the lifetime access, because one of my most favorite parts of Digital Course Academy is this worksheet that I created with all these decisions that you wouldn't even know to make these decisions. If someone who had gone before you didn't say, Look, I've made a lot of mistakes along the way. And it's decisions like will you offer live support at any time? What does your refund policy look like? Is it 30 days? 14 days? Do they need to do anything to get a refund? What does it look like in terms of if someone gets stuck? Or has questions? How are you going to address that? Will you have a Facebook group? When does the Facebook group start? When does it stop? Once you answer when someone can guide you and say these are all the things I messed up on? make these decisions? Now? Yeah, you can take a deep breath and be like, Okay, I've got those figured out. We're good. Let me focus on wowing my customers with my course. But there's a lot of little things that once you make the decision, you're good, but a lot of people don't even know they need to make those

Kate Kordsmeier 33:05

this Yeah, it's totally uh, you don't know, you don't know situation where you're starting. So I love that you added that to DCF super smart to just help people be like, Oh, I wouldn't have even thought about like needing a container or a policy regard. You know, either way. Yes.

Amy Porterfield 33:19

Yes. Yeah. Are you going to drip the content or give it all at once? And when does the course actually start? And all that stuff just needs to be decided?

Kate Kordsmeier 33:27

Yeah, for sure. Okay, so switching gears a little bit. But on the same line of thought, like we've been talking about kind of evolving changes, like now it's 2022. At the time of this is still like, right, it's 2022? I'm still a little off in my timeline. Yes. You know, so do you feel like, when does it make sense to do a course versus say, a membership or another kind of similar model? Like, how do you know, of course, is the way to go? Oh,

Amy Porterfield 33:56

I like this question. So when I think about courses and memberships, as you know, we have a mutual friend, Stu McLaren. And he teaches everyone how to do memberships. And I teach courses. And we always say, we go to bed together like peanut butter and chocolate because they just really go together well. And if I had my choice between courses and memberships, I'd say I want both I think both work really well in a business. And here's how I typically teach my students how to decide if you want to teach something. Well, there's an obvious start, and there's an obvious finish to something that you want to teach. Here's everything you need to do and boom, once you hit there, you're out like for me, here's how to create a course from scratch and how to launch it once it's launched. You're good you know how to do it. To me that is of course because there's an obvious start and finish and everything in between could be step by step by step that is in the beauty of a course and why I'm probably more biased toward courses obviously, is because I like a good start and finish and I like to step back and take a breather. Yeah, as a course creator. I love to be involved in my students. experience. But after those nine weeks, I'll take a step back and just do a relax a little bit. So I can be really great for my students when I come back. Yeah, with a membership. That's something that if you want to teach something brand new every single month and enrich their lives and add value in different ways, and not everything has to go together this month, you want to teach this one thing, the next month doesn't have to be build off the month you just taught, if you feel like you want your content to be a bit more fluid, that could absolutely be a membership. Now a lot of times people don't want to do a membership, because you're on that hamster wheel of content creation every month you got to create, but for you and I know we both have batched in our businesses, and if you can batch the content, you don't have to be on that hamster wheel. But for me what I do I have both. So I have two digital courses on evergreen. Then I have Digital Course Academy, which is my big most popular course that I do once a year live. And then I have momentum, which is my membership. And momentum helps people implement and continue the journey of course creation and launching and making it a something long term in their business. So after you finish DCA, you get a private invite, if you want to join me in momentum, you can join or if you want to skip Go ahead. But now I get to continue the journey. But you can only get into momentum. If you finish DCA so that I'm not reteaching everything I am building off of what you've learned, I'm troubleshooting with you, I'm helping you to go to the next level. So I love momentum, because there's people that are really serious about launching over and over again and getting really big results.

Kate Kordsmeier 36:33

Yeah, I love that. So I selfishly I'm thinking like this is something that some of my friends and I we a lot of us took this one program together and then created it's similar kind of business model, right? And then some of us were thinking like, Well, should it be a membership instead of like a 12 month program. And it's not necessarily that like, there's always something new every month, but there's always like new lives, new calls, like things not necessarily new material. Got it. I'm curious for even like momentum, people can join and cancel at any time.

Amy Porterfield 37:09

They can, so they can join in cancel at any time. And that, you know, there's so many different types of ways to do a membership. But let's say you had 12 months of a what you might call a membership and they have to enroll in 12 months. To me that feels like a 12 month coaching program, right, which feels different than a membership to me. So for me a membership, I think there'd be less hand holding less coaching less in there. Yeah, more around the content you're delivering every week. But so there and this is the beauty of being an entrepreneur and owning your own business. You get to decide and create what works best for you. You can call it whatever you want. But I love that we can kind of do iterations of each of the different things that we learn. Like there have been people that got into Digital Course Academy, and they've had great success made tons of money. But they haven't done it exactly how I teach it. They put their own spin on it for like a hybrid of a membership and a course and a little bit of a mastermind and they just figure out what works best for them. Yeah, I will support them all day long. Because at the end of the day, that's what makes being an entrepreneur. So freakin fun.

Kate Kordsmeier 38:15

Yeah, my friend Lutece always says it's all made up. And I love that because it's like, it is like, we're all just making it up figuring out like what works for us. I also I say like, everything works. Like there's for everybody that's like, you know, social media is the worst, which I'm always saying that but that's like, there's other people who are like social media as my whole business. Like without it, I would have nothing and they and it works for them doesn't work for me. And like, you know, some people might say, blogging doesn't work for them. And I'm like, No, blogging is my jam. Like, that's my thing. It all works. You just have to figure out what works for you. And you know that I mean, I think I'm kind of one of those students of yours. That was I came in, I did everything exactly the way that you said to do it first. And I was like, Well, I paid you to tell me what to do. So I better more like data. Yeah, yeah. And then I start iterating and evolving and going like, Okay, this is what I liked and what I didn't what felt good, you know, this is my lifestyle, my goals, my desires, those sort of things and like, evolving again, being yes to that. So, yeah, okay, so we're coming up on the end here. One question I have that I think might be an important one, especially heading into DCA is, is there ever a niche or a type of person who absolutely should not do a course?

Amy Porterfield 39:31

Oh, I've never been asked this before. Is there ever a niche or a type of person who should not do a course? I would say absolutely not. I feel like because I've seen so much I've seen so many courses that have succeeded based on so many different topics that you would never believe some I can't even or inappropriate that I can't even say here like a whole different world that I'm like, oh, that worked. Okay, great. But then all different walks of life. From different experiences, I've seen it all. So I can say with absolute certainty that everybody has a course or two in them. And you can turn anything into a course. But you do sometimes have to get creative because here's an example one of my students, she teaches how to overcome sexual trauma. And that is not a topic that a lot of people want to discuss publicly. So they're not going to tell their whole story on an Instagram comment or something like that. And so she has to get creative in terms of how she brings people into her world. So she says, Amy, I can't do a Facebook group with all of my students airing all their stories. So she'll do something like Voxer, where if some people want to talk to her during the course, they can privately message her. So she's tweaked her program so that it's not so public and outward, but it works for her. So I really do believe you have to tweak the course to make it work for you and your students. But anything will work in a digital course in any niche will work.

Kate Kordsmeier 41:02

Love it. Well, this was super fun. As always, you always have great answers and get me thinking about new ways of doing things. So thanks for coming again. I'm super excited for everyone to listen to this and check out Digital Course Academy this round. It seems like it's going to be the best yet.

Amy Porterfield 41:19

The best yet. So thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

Kate Kordsmeier 41:23

You're welcome.

Hey, y'all, Kate and Amy here wanting to jump in and tell you all about Digital Course Academy which as we mentioned, is opening for enrollment on September 7 2022. In the meantime, you can check out this year's brand new freebies, or if you have other questions and want to know more about Digital Course Academy. You can get all of your questions answered when you head to Kate kordsmeier.com/DCA, you'll be alerted when DCA opens up again this year, you can learn all about our bonus suite which is absolutely incredible, over $3,500 worth of free bonuses when you enroll through our link. And we're giving you all the information you need about Amy's five day boot camp and all of the other incredible freebies we have coming up for this month. We'll see you over there at Kate kordsmeier.com/DCA

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