112: Allowing Seasons of Hustle + Rest to Heal Burnout from Work, with Sabrina Gebhardt

Bront'e Singleton 0:00

Hey, hey, this is Bront'e J Singleton, current client and student of the incubator, the most amazing program that I've ever been in in my entire life. I just wanted to take a moment to share how amazing this program has been for me, my mindset, my business, my progress, and the wins that I've had since joining the program. So since joining the incubator, I've grown more confident in myself as a business woman as a person. And then my expertise and my ability to run my business, I was recently able to launch my course for language learners, which is amazing. And it was a huge undertaking. And because of this, I was able to make two sales on my first launch of my course, within my business as a whole, I've been able to create a system for content creation, and streamlining that process in a way that works for me and my business. So I'm less stressed out about what to post when and how. And the biggest thing which I never thought I'd be doing in my first year of business is that I created and turned on my evergreen funnel. The Incubator has given me the tools to be able to focus my time and attention on the things that really move my business and help my business grow, but also take time to take care of myself because if I'm not well, I don't have what I need, then I can't serve the people that I want to serve. So I 1,000% love the incubator program and I'm so glad so glad that I joined

Intro 1:19

you're listening to the Success with Soul podcast with Kate Kordsmeier, ex-journalist turned CEO of a multi six figure blog and online business. But it wasn't that long ago that Kate was a struggling entrepreneur who lacked confidence, clarity, and let's be honest money. But all those failures, experiments and lessons learned helped Kate create a thriving business that impacts 1000s and brings freedom, flexibility and fulfillment to her life. If you're ready to do the same and make something happen with holistic, soulful, step by step strategies from Kate and other experts, you're in the right place. Here's your host, writer, educator, mom, recovering perfectionist, bookworm and sushi connoisseur Kate Kordsmeier.

Indira 2:08

Welcome back to the Success with Soul podcast. I'm your guest host Indira with Team KK and today we're sharing a podcast interview Kate did with Sabrina Gephardt on her podcast, she did straight, there were so many gold nuggets, we wanted to make sure you all had a chance to listen to it. Kate and Sabrina talk about the relationship between hustle and ease. And what to do if you find yourself deeply in hustle and headed for burnout. They also talk about ways to build ease and rest into your every day. They both share a bit of their personal story and background with their own struggles, and how they change the direction of their business and the way they go about working and planning in their business every day. It's a really great conversation, and I'm excited to be sharing it with y'all. Let's dive in.

Sabrina 3:01

Today we have Kate Kordsmeier on the podcast. And she is in charge of a program that I've been in for almost a year called the incubator. And she is so phenomenal at leading women in business to not live in a place of hustle all the time and to build a business that is right for them. And that serves them in their hearts. So Kate, I'm gonna let you introduce yourself and then we're going to dive in.

Kate Kordsmeier 3:28

Thanks. What a nice introduction. Yes. So what else can I add? I have Yes, my group coaching program is the Success with Soul incubator, I created a blog myself back in 2015. And I sold it for multiple six figures in 2021. I was a journalist before that for nearly a decade. So I've had quite a few career transitions and business coaching has by far been my favorite. I love it.

Sabrina 3:57

Yeah. And you're so good at it. You're so good at it. Okay, so before we get to like the heart and the meat of what we're talking about today, let's back up a little bit so that the audience kind of understands where you're coming from and why I thought this would be a great chat to have with us specifically, like you mentioned, you've had different phases of your career that have led you to where you are now journalism and blogging and course recreation and live launching and then giving up social media. And so all these different phases, and through those phases, your views on working hard and hustling and building your business have changed and morphed with time. So tell us a little bit about that.

Kate Kordsmeier 4:38

Yeah, such a good question. And actually, the first thing I have to say is as you were just kind of saying that and I was thinking about it, I think one of the main lessons from all of that that just kind of came to me was like permission to do things your way and that there's gonna be plenty of gurus out there telling you this is the only way or like there's all these one size fit saw approaches. And I think when I look back on my career and even like, again, just the way that you laid it out like that, it was like, Oh yeah, I just kind of have always done me was cheesy, but like, I've just always followed my heart and just done things my way and believed that really the only thing I believed in was just myself and like, I can figure this out. And so with that belief, though, there has definitely been seasons of hustle and seasons of burnout and seasons of rest, and sometimes like mandatory rest, sometimes it was maternity leaves. And sometimes it was just like, I'm gonna plan for this, because I have come to realize how important it is. So I think the biggest difference for me in all those different places, and what I learned about hustle specifically, has been that in the beginning, you do have to hustle a little bit like you're creating something out of nothing. And so if you want to start seeing results relatively quickly, like you got to be all in. And I don't think that means you have to like, you know, work 100 hour weeks and totally neglect your family and yourself and your health and all of those things. But I do think it requires a little bit more upfront time investment, especially because you're most likely doing everything yourself. So you're wearing all the hats of like, you're building whatever business it is, you're providing the service that you provide. You're doing the bookkeeping, you're like also the janitor, you're also like, they're just all the hats. So that season is it's really hard. Like I think starting your business is one of the hardest phases in your business. And especially because you're kind of like, can I even do this. And so there's a lot of mind trash that comes up during that time. Now, what I've learned is, I probably didn't need to hustle as hard as I did put as much pressure as I did on myself. And that actually, when I can look back in hindsight, like when I was more in surrender mode, and was just like, I don't know how to figure this out, I'm just going to believe that it is going to work out and surrender a little bit and like take care of myself and simplify. I feel like simplifying also sometimes like synonymous with rest for me in a way that that's actually when I've experienced the most growth and expansion. I love that.

Sabrina 7:26

So I'm gonna back up a second, let's talk about like when you left the corporate world, quote, unquote, and you started your blog, and then you leaned into that, and you started really growing that? Do you think the first few seasons of rest, like you said, were more mandatory? Like did you force yourself into a wall and then your body's like, Nope, we're done here or degenerate? Proceed? Okay. Okay. Yeah. Now you've shifted into being able to plan for it and know when you're going to need it versus hitting out mandatory wall. Yeah,

Kate Kordsmeier 7:56

yeah, I think I have more foresight. Now, because I've done some of the things before. And I, you know, like everything is just trial and error. And you just see, like, everyone also has different thresholds of what they can handle and different life circumstances. Like I didn't have kids when I started my business. And now I have two kids, like, I have a very different threshold than I did back then. So it's always evolving, for sure. But yes, in the beginning, it was more like, I've reached max burnout. And I will, like, kill myself if I keep doing this. Yeah. So I have to rest. And then sometimes like this was, quote, unquote, maybe mandatory. But I was in a very different place when I took my first maternity leave. But that was such a gift to me, because I truly, I had one VA on my team, like part time, and I took three months off, like, I did not work for a minute, and the business grew. And it was like, Oh, my results are not directly proportional to the amount of hours I'm working. And so once I really saw that, in reality, then that really changed my whole perspective of like coming back to work and being like, Okay, I don't need to put in this much time to get most of the time. I'm just like, in motion being busy. I know, we talked about this in the incubator a lot. Like, I feel like I'm working a lot. And so because I'm in motion, and I'm busy, but actually, I'm not really taking action or taking like the right action that's going to move the needle. And so when I let go of all that other stuff that was just filling my time, but maybe not actually serving me, then that's when it's like, oh, now for the last two years, I've only worked 20 to 25 hours a week, and my business has continued to grow every single year.

Sabrina 9:39

Yeah, that's awesome. Would you be comfortable sharing? I guess some of the symptoms were when you were like hitting those first few times of like, mandatory burnout. We're gonna call it our mandatory rest when your body or your mind we're like now now. Now it's time to stop. Like What Did that feel like to you?

Kate Kordsmeier 9:58

Totally. I'm an open book. So While I was having lots of panic attacks all the time, totally unrelated to like business worry, or it felt like it was unrelated, right? It wasn't like I would sit down to work and have a panic attack, it would be like, I was just driving down the road. And all of a sudden, I'm freaking out and about what you know, like, it was definitely a physical manifestation that at the time felt separate. But as soon as I did force myself to take a step back and rest, it was like, oh, okay, yeah, there was a lot to unpack there. I would never have described myself as an anxious person before, like 2014. And 2015, is when I started my own, well, my second own business, and that was when everything really started coming to a head anxiety wise, and yeah, so it just became very digestion issues, hormonal imbalances, panic attacks, anxiety, there was a lot of like, physical body symptoms, and just like lack of presence in my actual life.

Sabrina 11:04

Yeah, I feel like people don't realize that burnout really is a physical problem. Like it goes from mental to physical. And then I feel like what oftentimes comes next is the depression phase, like there's so hand in hand, and, of course, not for all people. But in my own story, and I know, in a lot of other, you know, entrepreneurs, stories, it's they're overworking, they're hustling, then they get the physical manifestations of all of the problems and the struggles, that they're still not connecting the dots, and they're still just pushing through and pushing through, and maybe they're going to see a doctor about whatever. And then it's all of a sudden, you're depressed, you know, and it's like you didn't pay attention to all the warning signs. And now you're having to, you know, see a therapist and work through all the physical issues, and which all all are healthy practices and bad things. But the hole that you've put yourself in is even deeper than if you were to have heeded the warning signs in the first place. Right?

Kate Kordsmeier 12:02

Yeah. And this is like a totally different topic. So we I won't go down the rabbit hole. But I think it's important to say that a lot of times in our culture, people will tell you like, it's your food, it's your diet. And I have actually found that like, No, it was 100% stress. And when I reduce stress in my life, all of those physical, even chronic illnesses that I have, like I am hypothyroid, I do have PCOS, all of those flared up, not because I was eating gluten or drinking, you know, lattes, it was like, because I was stressed out of my mind and putting an insane amount of pressure on myself, putting all of my self worth in the business, and what I was achieving, and how much money we were making, and things like that. And it was like, once I separated those things, even chronic illnesses became like in remission, so to speak.

Sabrina 12:54

Yeah, yeah, it's wild. How our minds do that. I mean, it's just, it's absolutely wild. And I have found the same thing. You know, we are living very similar lifestyles now as far as like all of the self care and mental care and, and just all the things that we're doing. And while I do think there are parts to solving those problems with, you know, diet and what I'm putting in my body, and how I'm moving my body, and all those things, like the rest and the trying to stay out of burnout mode. And that is a huge piece, like, you know, and I also think there's a huge piece of that, because when we are not in that constantly anxious, overworked hustle mode, we are more aware of what's happening, right? Like I can feel when I'm stressed in my body, I can notice that my digestion is off, I can tell that I'm not sleeping well. Like I'm more aware of what's happening. Yeah, okay. So currently in the entrepreneur space, there's so much like hustle work for it. You have to put in the work, you have to you know, show up and all these things that it seems like sometimes rest almost gets a bad rap. And I do think that tide is starting to change, which I'm so happy about. But if you were to meet a new female entrepreneur, or somebody comes into the incubator, and you're having conversation with her, and she's really struggling with stopping and allowing herself true rest, like what do you say to her?

Kate Kordsmeier 14:24

So I think my answer on this has changed. The more I've been a coach, the more I've worked with women, and I really see what this is really about. I think at first it always feels like this more surface level strategy thing like oh, let me give you passive strategies to try. But I found that actually what it really is, is that people are not safe psychologically to rest. And so it's really actually like unpacking your own trauma your own. Like the stories that you tell yourself. Like for example, I had wonderful parents like I was loved I was cared for Our beautiful relationship with both my parents. My dad, though is somebody who's like we don't sleep in, there's work to be done. Like, don't be lazy. An A minus isn't good enough, it needs to be an A plus, you know, like, there was a lot of kind of hustle culture growing up. So it took me years of like unpacking some of those things to be like, Oh, it was like, psychologically dangerous for me to rest for me to not be productive. And so sometimes we'll be like, Oh, I rested, because I wasn't working. But I was cleaning the house, and I was running errands. And I was doing this. And it's like, that's also not rest. So anyway, long story short, I think it really is more about doing some of that uncomfortable inner work to figure out what is your story about why rest is not safe for you?

Sabrina 15:52

Yeah, I 100% agree. And I have similar but different reasoning behind it. So in my childhood, I went through several years of like, really deep grief and trauma, my parents were going through a horrible divorce. My mom was recently diagnosed bipolar and was all over the board with mood swings, and there's all this just horrible stuff. And at the time, I was, you know, older middle school going into high school. And that is literally when I know that I started being overly busy and overly doing, because it was safer for me to be in other places, and involved in other ways than it was to be at home. And then when I was achieving in those other things in these clubs, and you know, drill team, and choir and my grades and all this, that's when I was getting, let's say, the only positive feedback that was coming into my life. And so that is literally when I started the overachieving and the staying busy. And it's not safe to be at home and reading in my room, it's, I've got to be out, I've got to be doing, I've got to be achieving. And all of that stuff came up in therapy, you know, because I was struggling to rest, I literally could not allow myself to stop and sit on the couch and read a book to stop and watch a show to sleep in I like I would try. And it was like I was physically radiating anxiety from like, trying to stop. Yeah, and that's what it comes from. And it's it's still hard for me. And it's still something I have to work on. Like it'll be a lifelong project of, you know, trying to allow that. But it's so ingrained, you know, I think you're right that no matter if it comes from somebody's childhood, like yours, or like mine, or if it comes from something else, all together, there is some sort of core component, the why you can't stop, why you you have a hard time resting

Kate Kordsmeier 17:50

well. And that kind of makes me think to just about getting more comfortable with being uncomfortable. And like it is deeply uncomfortable to rest. If you have never rested before, if you knew as a kid, something bad will happen if I rest and so I need to stay busy, you know, whatever it might be. So it's deeply uncomfortable to actually rest. But it is so important, and it will heal so many other things in your life besides your relationship to work and business. And I think that general sentiment of being okay with being uncomfortable is like one of the quote unquote, like secrets to success is like you have to be it is uncomfortable to make a mistake to try something and have it not work to put yourself out there to take a risk by investing in something into your business, whether it's coaching or like a software or whatever it might be. It is so uncomfortable to do those things. But the people who are willing to risk uncomfortability I think are the ones that actually end up more quote unquote, successful.

Sabrina 18:57

Yeah, I agree. 100%. And it's super hard, especially for somebody who's maybe a newer entrepreneur who's never stepped into like, doing something brand new or starting something or learning something or whatever. I mean, there's a lot of fear and discomfort there. You know, and being willing to push past it, but I love that you say you know resting is uncomfortable because it is yeah, it seems

Kate Kordsmeier 19:18

like oh, this will be great. I'm just laying around and yeah, oh, my body is like, why are you doing this isn't really right.

Sabrina 19:25

And especially as moms I mean like as women just there's so many parts to that puzzle. And I often tell people when I'm talking about rest, I'm not talking about going on a family vacation because that's not restful.

Kate Kordsmeier 19:40

I need a vacation after my right

Sabrina 19:42

I'm not even talking about going on like a vacation with just your spouse or your girlfriend like I'm talking about resting in your home or in your day to day or just truly where you don't have an agenda. You have a to do list. You don't have nothing. There's nothing

Kate Kordsmeier 20:03

Hey there, are you a soulful woman seeking community tools and support to reconnect with your true self and find healing. If you are wanting personal growth, peace and success in all areas of your life, from relationships to well being money and spirituality, then I invite you to join me at our free live event on Tuesday, February 7, at 4pm. Eastern. During this event, you'll have an exclusive preview to our new Success with Soul membership before the cart officially opens the next day. So head on over to Kate kordsmeier.com, forward slash live to sign up today. I'm excited to see you on the inside. And PS this is for all women, not just entrepreneurs, this is for your whole life, not just business, I hope to see you there. And we'll tell you more about it. Plus, you'll get some special offers that are exclusive to those people who show up live, not to mention a free soul session. See you there.

Sabrina 21:08

Okay, so we're both Enneagram threes. So rest is extra extra hard for us. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs are Enneagram threes, just by nature. And like you said earlier, especially in the first few years, your business, there are so many things to do wearing all of the hats, there's so many moving parts, hustle is valid at times. I mean, if you don't ever lean into hustle like things just won't ever get off the ground. Like there is a piece to that. How do you think female entrepreneurs can go about balancing the relationship between hustle and rest.

Kate Kordsmeier 21:41

So I feel like there's a couple different things here. One is planning for seasons of rest and hustle and anything in between in your business. And so if you're a photographer, and you know that the fall is always going to be like, you're not going to plan to rest in November that like if you're doing family photos is not an option. So don't plan it for then. And then then be mad at yourself because you didn't you couldn't do it or you didn't rest well enough or whatever. So you know, think about your actual niche and industry and what that looks like. And if you can write all the rules yourself, then just think about like in your own life, like what's happening in winter, spring, summer fall, and just look at the Four Seasons and like which of those could be a little bit more restful, which are going to be like, alright, we're probably going to have some live events, we're going to launch something, maybe I'm just like busy calendar wise as a service provider, you know, whatever it might be, but actually becoming consciously aware and making the intentional decision that this is when I'm gonna go hard. And then this is when I'm gonna pull back and recover. And it's just like, exercise, like, you don't just stand up from your couch and go run a marathon like there's so much prep and training that goes into that, then there's the actual execution of like running the marathon. And then when you're done, you don't just like go to sleep, like you gotta stretch, you got to recover. So I think like thinking of work in that same way. And building in those prep execution, recovery. Rest is like one of the most powerful things you can do for yourself.

Sabrina 23:26

Yeah, I love that. If somebody is listening, and they are still deep in full throttle, hustle, they are just going going going building, pushing it leaning into something new, do you have a warning for her or something that you want to advise this listener about just making sure that she's got some rest coming?

Kate Kordsmeier 23:47

Yeah. So it is great to have those like full seasons of rest. And that may not be like an entire, you know, like nature of season, but it could be a week, it could be a month, whatever. But even more than that is actually finding ways to build rest into your daily routine. And so yeah, you might be kind of balls to the wall in your business getting things started. But that doesn't mean that you can't take 10 minutes to do like a meditation or a tapping or some kind of grounding, exercise, journaling, whatever in the morning. And then maybe have some kind of like five minute gratitude practice at the end of the day, or whatever it might look like for you making sure you're fitting in like exercise and, you know, other self care activities that again, some are good that it's like yeah, it's great to go to the chiropractor and get a massage and take bubble baths but like that's not going to like heal your trauma. It's not going to, you know, so like, what are the daily things that you can do that are really going to turn inward? Stop taking in external stimuli and just real They go within yourself, at least for a few minutes a day.

Sabrina 25:03

That's so key, I think, you know, if you're coming off of a season of really crazy burnout and crazy hustle, you do need a few weeks or maybe a month to like really unpack, I always say it's like a, it's like you're a bucket of water and you are just overflowing like you can't even function because the water is splashing around. And it's just completely overflowing. And you have to get it down to a level where there's still some room at the top for day to day stuff that happens. And until you get it to where there's a couple of inches of space at the top to allow for life to happen. Like you've got to keep resting and unpacking and getting some of that stuff out of the bucket. Right. But after you do that, like you said, it's the day to day maintenance. And I don't know about you, but I find myself. I'm much better about it now than I was years ago. But I've I would find myself sometimes like, Oh, I'm feeling really good right now. So I can skip the XYZ this week and my work a little bit more, right? Yes,

Kate Kordsmeier 25:56

I'm relatable.

Sabrina 25:58

I mean, there'll be times where I don't need to do that I don't need I'm good. I'm good, I'm good. And I've learned to really try and avoid that as much as possible. Because it really just takes a couple of times of like pushing through stuff. And you find yourself right back in deep burnout. And in a really bad place. Have you created any boundaries to like, save yourself from yourself? You know?

Kate Kordsmeier 26:21

Oh, my gosh, boundaries are even more important for me than boundaries. Right?

Sabrina 26:26

So okay, so let's talk about that. If you know that you're looking at your calendar, and you're heading into a big launch or a big season of something new where you are going to be hustling and building that thing. And you do have some serious rest time planned for after that hustle. What boundaries are you putting in place to make sure you actually take it? Because sometimes we get through a launch season or we get something new built? And we feel great. Because like we're leaning into our intuition, we're doing the thing we're supposed to be doing and it feels really good. Yeah. And it's, it's easy to think we can like skip over and like just jump straight into the next thing. So like, what boundaries are you putting in place to save yourself from yourself?

Kate Kordsmeier 27:06

I love this question. Yeah, I can so relate to just like waiting until I'm in crisis mode before I'm like, oh, yeah, that's right. I haven't done any of my self care practices for weeks, because I was feeling so good. And even like my friends and I joke that, you know, on like antidepressants or anti anxiety medication, and then a few months, and you're like, I feel great. I don't need this medicine. You feel great, because the medicines working? Right, right? Yeah. Okay, so boundaries that I put in place. So one thing that I do is I always build in at least one week where I'm off work, no matter what it doesn't have to be like, immediately after the launch or the event. But like sometime in those next couple of months, like I need a week where I'm not doing anything work related. And the boundary that helps me is, and this is interesting, because I'm not normally somebody that needs like accountability on it, I feel like I have so much self accountability for things but telling somebody else, so telling my clients, like we're closed, so we're always closed the last two weeks of December of the year. And so we tell our clients that like as soon as they join, it's like, we're not going to be here in the last two weeks, we encourage you to do the same. And one of the reasons we do that is because we almost always have some kind of event in November. And so it's like, we know, we are going to need to just like chill. And of course, you know, it's the end of the year, and probably you just need to chill at the end of the year regardless, so tell your clients, if you have a team, tell your team. And even if your whole team's not taking off like just for me to say I'm going to be off for you know this amount of time. On a more daily basis. Something that I did just for the first time this year is I removed all work related apps from my phone forever. I used to be like, Oh, on the weekends, I'll delete some things and then I'd add them back. Or then I kind of stopped doing it because I'm like, this is a pain to kind of have to keep deleting and bringing him back. So now I have no email, no Voxer no slack, no clickup Like none of our work tools and communications. So if I want to work at the end of the day, when I'm technically done or first thing in the morning when I like first wake up in bed and I want to grab my phone and check my email or something like I have to actually come down into my office and open up my computer. And usually that's enough for me to like almost just to pause and go like yeah, I don't really want to do that. But when it's just on your phone it's so easy and I just didn't have the self control to like I tried setting the app limit but then it asks you Are you sure and I'm like no ignore for 15 more minutes. So again, like a save myself for myself. I just removed the choice and that has been such a game changer like it was almost like I didn't realize how much I really was is working in the off hours because of having access to everything on my phone.

Sabrina 30:05

I love that that's such a good boundary. Okay, so this has been a really great chat. And I can't wait to re listen to it as well. I feel like this is one of those episodes that people will be able to listen to more than once and really pull different pieces from it. I like to end every interview with some rapid fire fun personality type questions before we go. So what is your current coffee shop? caffeination order.

Kate Kordsmeier 30:32

I'm just holding up my Starbucks as you asked that. So I can't drink caffeine, because it makes my anxiety crazy. So I do drink decaf coffee though every single day. And I don't always go to a coffee shop. But lately, it's you know, November 1 At the time of this recording. It's a venti whole milk, decaf pumpkin spice latte with half the pumps, because it's too sweet for me if it's all Yes,

Sabrina 30:59

too many pumps. I love that I love that I, I should probably cut back on my caffeine intake.

Kate Kordsmeier 31:07

I drink caffeine for so many years. Again, I didn't used to like having anxiety like I do as an adult. Or maybe I did and I just didn't know what it was. But yeah, once when I started having panic attacks my therapist, like, why don't you just try cutting out caffeine for a week. And when I did, I was like, wow, this is such a difference. And now when I drink it, it's like, oh my gosh, I feel like my heart is going to explode out of my chest.

Sabrina 31:32

Yeah. Okay, that's interesting. Maybe I'll have to try that. Okay, dream vacation, like Money's no object, your kids are not going. It's just you and your spouse. What's your dream vacation.

Kate Kordsmeier 31:43

So I feel like I always want to go somewhere new. I used to be a travel writer. So I got to go to lots of amazing places. And I'm like, oh, Portugal is up on our list of where we want to go next. But I think actually, it's like, Money's no object that kids aren't coming. I actually just want to redo my honeymoon, which was in Thailand, we went to this amazing resort that was off. And I like a teeny tiny island off of Phuket. And it was just like, you know, whenever anybody's like, visualize a time that you felt totally happy and relaxed and at peace, like I go right to the like balcony of that room and watching the sunrise every morning. And like, yeah, I just want to go back there.

Sabrina 32:25

Oh, my gosh, that's awesome. I love that. Okay, thinking back over the course of your business and all the shifts that you've made, what was if you could pinpoint what was a decision or an investment that you made that you feel like was the biggest game changer?

Kate Kordsmeier 32:39

Or so many? I'm like, quitting social media is definitely one of them. I think though, what's coming up for me most is I decided that it takes money to make money. And in the beginning, I went for like over a year of doing the business, trying to do it the freest way possible. And that is also usually the slowest, most confusing, convoluted piecemealed way to do things, right. And I, I kept asking, like, every mentor, everybody I could like, do you think it takes money to make money does take money to make money? And once I just decided, like, yeah, of course it does. You can't create something out of nothing with nothing, right? Then it just was like, Okay, it's gonna cost me money to build this business, and not like willy nilly, I'll just spend on anything, but I think it relieves so much stress of like, trying to do it without spending any money and just gave me permission to like, this is a business, the average business costs $48,000 to start an online business, I can do this for like, $2,000, but I probably need to spend that $2,000 And stop, you know, stressing about it.

Sabrina 33:51

Yeah. And I am a full believer in that as well. And I also think that it helps with your stress level, because you're getting like this, this easy button you're getting like the Fast Pass to all of these quote unquote, insider secrets, somebody is taking you along. And you know, assuming you're investing in education or a mentor program or something like that. Somebody is taking you along and giving you everything you need to know like you said, it's it's faster, it's easier, but kind of like we said in the beginning, it's being willing to like step into the fear. Yeah, work, fork over the money and trust yourself.

Kate Kordsmeier 34:28

Yeah, that you can't, there's no guarantee that anything you ever do is going to give you a return on investment. And sometimes the return on investment isn't financial, like right, okay, I may not have made that exact money back whether it's like coaching or again like a software or some kind of, you know, hiring a team member or something but like, sometimes it's the community got out of it. It's the mindset and personal development work you got. It's like, you know, it's I was able to provide this service to people I couldn't have done it if I didn't have this tool. or whatever and, and they always learn something. So absolutely,

Sabrina 35:03

absolutely. Okay, last question. If you were not today in business coaching, what do you think you'd be doing?

Kate Kordsmeier 35:10

So you did send me this in advance and I was thinking about this. What would I be doing? You know, every now and then you have those like, what if I burned it all to the ground and just started over? What would I do? I kind of think and maybe this is because I've got two toddlers at home. And this is just so opposite my life right now. But I think I might want to go back to food and travel writing. That was a really fun job.

Sabrina 35:31

Yeah, I bet it was. And I bet you totally, like are envious of that past life. Because that's just not where you are now. A

Kate Kordsmeier 35:39

little different life. Yeah.

Sabrina 35:43

That's so awesome. Well, this has been a fantastic chat. Thank you, for your time. Share how people can connect with you because it's not on Instagram.

Kate Kordsmeier 35:51

That's true. Yes. Okay. So right I again, I I'm a fan of doing things your way. I am not a fan of social media for many reasons. So I'm not on Instagram or Tik Tok, or whatever the kids are doing these days. And best place to find me is honestly just on my website, Kate kordsmeier.com. I also have a podcast called Success with Soul. So you can find that wherever you're listening to this podcast. And I'd love to share a free gift with your audience, which is our cyclical Living Guide. And this will really help again, with planning those seasons of rest and hustle and really understanding like, not only, you know, like I said your industry or your personal schedule, but also looking at some things like what's happening in the universe with the cosmos and the moon, what's happening in your body with fear have a menstrual cycle, and using some of those indicators to also help you have a little bit more cyclical success in your business. Yes. So that's it, Kate kordsmeier.com/free gift.

Sabrina 36:50

Awesome. It is a good one. So make sure you grab it. We'll have all of the links in the show notes. Thank you for being here, my friend. It was a great chat. You're welcome. Thanks

Kate Kordsmeier 36:57

for having me. I hope you've been inspired by this episode and feel ready to take action on your dreams and goals. If so, please hit subscribe. This makes it possible for me to continue to provide free helpful content and bring you amazing guests. Just go to iTunes or wherever you listen to podcasts and subscribe so that you know when we released a new episode, and you never miss a thing. Plus, we often put timely opportunities in our shows. So if you don't subscribe, you might miss something valuable

Transcribed by https://otter.ai